Empower: Energizing Bitcoin & Ai

We are back, baby.

Back.

It's been a while.

It's been a, it's been a minute.

We've uh, we've been a little busy.

Little busy.

We have, we're still leaking
out episodes from Austin from

November that we never released.

Right.

We, we gotta get Christians out.

Christian Lopez, we release this.

We gotta get it some point.

We did.

Yeah.

Did that one come out?

Dude, I need to go like
tweet some stuff about that.

No, it was a good episode.

Yeah, Christian's the man.

I love that dude.

We've been putting in a lot
of work behind the scenes.

I know it may not seem like it
and everybody keeps asking us,

Hey, are we still doing episodes?

Of course, we are just wanting to go
a little bit of a different direction.

I think with the show, you know,
we've wanted to expand the scope.

Give more into the intersection
of not only Bitcoin mining and

energy, but really AI compute and
infrastructure, uh, and power generation.

I think that that's just,
there's a convergence that's

happening between all of these.

We've seen AI players turn into Bitcoin
miners, Bitcoin miners turn into, I.

The AI players power is gonna
be underpinning all of it.

It's the, you know, it's the
hot topic at, you know, any

gathering, uh, in this space.

And so, plus there's only
so many Bitcoin miners.

We can only talk to so many groups.

And so really wanting to understand
everything that's happening, I.

At this intersection between all of
this, and that's where I'm focusing

my time personally and as, as are you.

And we'll kinda talk some more
about that, but wanting to expand

the, the scope of the show and
really wanting to, to put a lot more

effort, uh, into this mean it's fun.

We, we really enjoy it.

And so we're gonna be taking
this thing on the road.

We'll be hitting, uh,
Bitcoin 2025 conference.

Uh, probably doing a whole
bunch of shows there.

There's also, I, I got, um,
somebody mentioned to me,

uh, Bitcoin Park in Austin.

There's something that's happening.

Yeah.

They're doing the Texas
Energy and Mining Summit.

Uh, I think it's May 6th and seventh.

And I don't know if you ever got to go
to the one in Nashville at Bitcoin Park.

Uh, no.

I never got to make it out.

Dude is super dope.

I think it's one of the best, um,
events that I've been to and really

high quality speakers, high quality
content, and Bitcoin Park is just dope.

Really, really dope.

The Nashville one, uh, Bitcoin.

Commons is now Bitcoin Park Austin.

So that's what it is.

I've had people ask me about that
too, and I'm like, you know, I

wasn't sure until I saw it just
literally like a couple weeks ago.

So, um, but yeah, they're doing
the Texas Energy and Mining

Summit May 6th and seventh.

Um, I'm just waitlisted.

I don't know what that means.

I don't know.

I, I, I hope I get in, like I've been
involved in mining in Texas for a while.

I, I'm Parker, dude, you gotta,
you gotta get me in there.

So.

Yeah, I, well, I mean, he's
part of it, so they, I, okay.

I'm not sure, I haven't heard the story
of like how, 'cause Bitcoin park, um,

in Nashville, like they set up that
whole facility that, how did you go

there when you were out in Nashville?

N no, I never get to tell that dude.

It's, it's super, it's sick.

I love the way they did it.

They, they had, you know,
that kind of site and I think.

Now Bitcoin Commons became
Bitcoin Park Austin.

I think they're kind of trying to
implement the same type of vibe

and all that, which is super cool.

And, and I think they're, you
know, that event, they were usually

doing it like South by Southwest,
um, or during Bitcoin takeover.

Um, I think it's kind of.

Uh, you know, they still did that this
year, but I think it's kind of like,

you know, maybe this is gonna be more
like the event in Nashville and Gotcha.

Again, they do that in January.

Um, super cool though, man.

Really just high quality folks there and
much more intimate than like your typ

typical like conference or whatever, which
we should talk about in power, by the way.

So we were in Fort Lauderdale for Money
Disrupt, and we got a lot of time to

talk and got to talk to a lot of people.

And this has been a theme for at least
like the last year, is everybody kind of

corners me at a, uh, social gather and
they're like, when are we doing in power?

Can you please bring it back?

So.

We've been thinking about it and
it's something that we definitely

want to do for the community.

However, I don't have the desire
to host another really large

conference, and I'll tell you why.

Uh, for one, it's a lot of work.

Um, the last three empowers that we
did took six months of my life each,

and that was like pretty much the
only thing that I was focused on.

Don't get me wrong, they were amazing
and I loved it, and it was awesome.

I'm so glad that we did it.

Um, but with everything that I have going
on, it's, it's just not, uh, realistic.

And the same thing is if I put myself
in the shoes of an attendee, right?

Usually you're there for a
few different reasons, right?

We're all there to do business, we're
all there to network and hang out.

But if you really get down to, I.

Making those kind of connections.

You know, if you're somebody who's like
new to the space and you're looking

to get deals done and you show up and
there's 1200 people there, you're kind

of just shotgun blasting, you know?

So you'd go hang out at the expo for a
little bit, go to the content, hang out

at the networking parties, and just try to
meet the people that you're looking for.

So we have kind of started to
reimagine what Empower can be.

And so if we can get jump to straight
to the end of like making deals happen

and making Empower a little bit more
deal centric, what does that look like?

And so we've been talking a
lot about reimagining this

as more of like a retreat.

And so the numbers would obviously
be significantly smaller.

This would be a lot more
of an exclusive event.

And the vision here is to bring together
miners, uh, AI infrastructure groups,

data center builders, um, people in the
power gen space and capital providers.

Right?

And so I see the.

The, the nucleus of this really
being centered around having groups

that have vetted deals, come out and
pitch their deals to the room, right?

And then have the investors be able
to look at, uh, perspectives of all

the deals, including the deal that's
being presented, and then say, Hey,

I would love to meet with this group.

And then after that, move
on to some speed dating.

To where we can actually
make these things happen.

Um, events like this have been
very successful in the past,

in totally different spaces.

Um, this is how I met some people
that I've become great friends with

in the past through, uh, like the
Rice Alliance does a, like a tech, uh.

Like a VC thing.

So if you're a startup and you wanna
meet with investors, I got to meet

with a ton of investors, get a lot of
really great feedback, um, with people

that I'm still friends with today.

And so just taking that same
kind of format, so it's like

that kind of meets like Nape.

But for this space, I.

I think that that would be really magical.

Um, so from the, the, the vision here
is from the time that you land at

whatever the venue is, that we decide
everything will be all inclusive.

And so this, the ticket price,
whatever it may be, will include,

um, the two nights of stay at.

It's gonna be a really nice
place wherever we decide.

Um, all food, all drinks, everything else.

Uh, there's gonna be a lot of
activities that we're gonna be doing.

It's not just gonna be stuffy,
sitting at a conference watching

a ton of, um, panels all day.

Um, there's not gonna be
an expo portion whatsoever.

Um, so we have already
started a wait list.

And so if you wanna go to
energizing bitcoin podcast.com,

there's a wait list you can go and, um.

Throw your name on there, give us a
little bit of feedback, and uh, we

plan on kind of opening this up and if
there's enough demand and if people are

interested in enough in this, then we'll
pull it off and we'll do it sometime

in probably the first half of 2026.

Yeah, and um, I'll be honest, man, the
biggest reason I'm excited about it is.

I am really sick of conferences
being basically the same thing.

And we've talked about this
a lot, um, and I've heard it

from literally this week alone.

I've had like five people talk to
me about how boring the conferences

have gotten and just repetitive.

And, and it gets to where it's like,
man, we're literally just seeing each

other in a new town or a new city.

Same people over and over.

This, this.

Think there, there's room
for this, in my opinion.

I mean, we wouldn't be trying to do
it if, if we didn't think there was.

So I think it'll, it'll go
over well and I think it's, I

think there is a need for it.

Um, you know, we'll get into a
little bit about what each of us

are working on and, and doing now.

Um, but bringing capital to
groups that need it, um, and

groups that are looking for it is.

What it, it's a great purpose
for a event like this.

And, um, I know you, you recently went to
one and felt like you, you know, you got

a lot out of it and, you know, new wave,
like, I think you mentioned it already.

I know we've talked about it so much,
so that might be what's in my mind.

But New Wave was one.

Um, it's where I met you dude, so
yeah, so, but it was a lot closer.

Yeah, more intimate.

It was the only, it was the only
retreat that we ever did with,

with Digital Wildcatters and there
was like 60 people I think total.

And we had some really great names.

Uh, Toby Rice was there, John Farber from
Lime Rock, uh, a bunch of other people.

And yeah, we had a couple small little
sessions about some hot topics, kind

of Chatham House rules, and then
we had a variety of activities and

dinners and the fire pit was open
until like, you know, super late.

People were out there hanging out, doing,
doing oil and gas deals until like two.

Yeah, Justin tries to beat up a comedian.

Um, thankfully that
didn't stifle his career.

He's gone on to do great things
and he's become really popular.

Who, me?

Or the, uh, comedian?

Uh, both, you know?

Yeah.

Uh, definitely him.

He is definitely.

But yeah, like that, like you
said, that's where we met.

We just so happened to
get matched up on the, um.

On the golf day.

And so we were in the cart together
just kind of driving around and

then we just kind of hit it off
and, you know, everything you see

here is, is, is a result of that.

So yeah, mashing kind of like that new
wave retreat concept with, with the

empower crowd and expanding the scope
of that a little bit to include our

brethren in the AI and power gen space.

And so if this is something you guys
are interested in, fill out the wait

list, give us a little bit feedback
and uh, we're gonna pull it off.

I think it's gonna be super dope.

I do, and here's the thing, I just, we,
we have a little bit more freedom because

historically we were constrained because
that was the business model at the time,

um, for Digital Wild Canada, right?

We're a media company.

We had to make money on those.

So to be absolutely clear,
this makes money great.

If it doesn't, as long as it like breaks
even then we're like totally fine.

Right?

And this is more of, um.

Continue to move the space forward.

Um, you know, this, this is
aligned with, with what both of

us are doing kind of individually.

And so we want, we hear
you, we want to do it.

Um, this is how we're imagining it.

And so if this is a great
idea, fill out the wait list.

If it's a terrible idea, fill out the
wait list and also tells a terrible idea.

Um, and then we will take into
consideration that feedback as well.

Right.

Right.

But again, it's gonna be dope.

It's gonna be a good idea.

It's gonna, yeah, we've already
talked to a lot of people and

they're all, literally everybody I've
talked to is super excited about it.

So, um, plus man, I mean,
there's a cool factor.

Like Jake Corley is gonna be there,
you know, running shit, coming

up with, I mean, where else are
you gonna get that, you know?

No energizing Bitcoin.

That's it.

That's it.

That's it.

Well, you've had a lot of life changes
recently, so what do you, yeah.

What do you, the people don't
know what you've been up to.

I know what you're up to, but what,
what, what life changes have happened?

What are you working on?

What are you excited about?

Uh, man, all kinds of them.

Um, so big one, obvious one for,
um, me and you that we've talked

about is, uh, no longer with Aon.

Um, that was, that was as
of, I don't know, a month or

two ago, something like that.

Um, close some nice deals there.

Uh.

Create a lot of value and, and
opportunity and, um, proud of that

and excited about, um, what I did.

But, uh, just, you know, it was time
to, to move on to different things

and I wish them luck and I think
that, uh, they, they will have some

good things going on, I'm sure.

But, um, yeah, man, it was just.

There are some opportunities out there
too that I think I want to pursue a

little bit more, which we've talked about.

And, um, one of 'em is, uh, I, I've been
doing a lot of work with Texas Energy

Group and Waylon Johnson over the last,
and it's been probably eight months,

honestly, since I've, I've been around,
uh, working with him over there at TEG.

Uh, they're trying to get
their name a little bit bigger.

You know, he, uh.

He sold pump jack power last year.

Um, I think, you know, they've been
kind of closing that up for a while.

So, uh, this is like a new endeavor
that he is got going and, um, we've

got some cool stuff we're working on,
on, on the gas side of things, so.

Everybody's gonna, we're gonna
talk about that with you too.

But, um, yeah, it's, it's,
we've got a lot of traction.

I'm excited about what we're
putting together and there's a big

need for it, as we'll talk about
here in a little bit as well.

Um, but also, uh, working with
Emery Energy and my boy Russell

Koon over there and George McHale,
uh, been working with those.

Russell Russell's great.

I get to meet him for the
first time in Fort Lauderdale.

This's a chill guy, dude.

Super chill.

He's just immaculate vibes.

Right?

You gotta meet George too.

You, yeah.

George is phenomenal.

Well, yeah, you met him on
when he came on the show.

Yeah.

But like, man, just those two dudes.

Like I got, I got a few friends.

All right.

I got a lot of people I know and
that I consider great people.

Um, but like my close, close
friends and Well, obviously

you, you're my boy dude, but.

George and Russ are two of the other ones.

Um, obviously there's a lot more too, and
everybody knows, you know who you are.

Um, Mario, you're one of my boys
too, so, but uh, but like it's hard

to find people that you want to work
with, um, for a long time and that

you can kind of trust on that level.

Um, you are one of 'em, like I just
said, but Russ and George are definitely

on that list too, and like for me.

Like being spiritually aligned
with somebody is hard to find.

'cause I'm kind of a weirdo
and a little bit of a hippie.

Um, but we're all dying, right?

We're all dying.

I got, I'm getting that tattoo.

My daughter, Ash actually asked me
about getting a tattoo the other day.

She turned 18 and I've been
kind trying to figure out where.

To push her and the whole Memento
Moray Marcus really stuff.

I'm trying to really get her into that.

So yeah, man Mo, we're all dying.

And, uh, George and Russ both like,
understand that and like live by that.

And there's, there's making
money's very important when

you're going to business ventures.

And it's actually like basically the goal.

Um, but doing so with
people that are like.

Spiritually aligned with you, dude,
and kind of got the same philosophy

on life and outlook is really,
really, really high importance to me.

And uh, so yeah, dude, I'm excited for
what we're gonna be doing over there.

We're basically a way
I would describe it is.

Almost like, uh, well,
we're, we're mining already.

Um, but you said the
site in Victoria, right?

That you guys set up, right?

Yeah.

You got site in Victoria.

Um, and it's doing great, um, but going
to expand a lot more and look for other

mining opportunities, uh, in addition to
some like more creative ones and working

directly with some co-ops or utilities and
load balancing and looking for kind of.

Peak time, uh, structures where we
can almost work with those groups

to attack some opportunities.

And I'm, I wanna look at some
wind farms and a whole lot of just

generation opportunities where,
you know, you don't necessarily,

they're, they're quick returns.

Um, also really looking heavily.

Into things like quarterly energy,
which I'll let you talk about.

But, um, the power generation side
we're very, very, in getting into

some oil and gas opportunities, like
just blending all the, the things that

you and I and have spent probably the
last 10, 15 years of our lives on.

Um, and kind of combining 'em all into
opportunities that are gonna be really,

really, um, accretive financially and
and of value to us and to the company.

But.

Also just doing it with kind of the,
the right intentions in mind, man.

And so I'm very, I'm, I am super excited
about all the stuff I'm working on.

Uh, Waylon's a great dude, TEG.

They've got a great group
of people over there.

Um.

One of my daughters is
over there, uh, as well.

So that's been fun and
getting to work with her.

And, uh, I know we've talked just about
it before, but we're gonna have kind

of TEG stepping in and doing like, uh,
some ercot updates and market updates

going forward, things like that.

So we're not only.

We're gonna expand the show too, I
guess was what we needed and kind

of structure it a little bit more.

In the past, we usually just shoot,
show up and shoot the shit and have a

good time, which we're gonna still do.

We don't wanna lose that aspect of
it, but we want to, we wanna, you

know, kind of bring some additional
things in and expand what we do, but.

But yeah, from a work, from man, I'm,
you know, TEG and, and Emory and then

I'm still working some deals on the
side and, you know, I got my hand in

a lot of stuff still, but, you know,
trying to, trying to narrow the group

of people that I'm working with, I.

You know what I'm saying?

I'm excited for you.

I mean, I think this is, this is
absolutely, absolutely right up your lane.

Not to toot your horn too
much, but I mean, you see more

deals probably than anybody.

And I think that you're equipped and,
you know, especially with, with Emery

to go out and release, cease this,
there's just so much opportunity.

So they're lucky to have you,
you're lucky to have them.

So I do want to give, uh, a quick
shout out to, uh, Jim Meosa,

who he said he is been Oh yeah.

You guys on your site.

So I tweeted, um, my, uh, my mom came to
me and she goes, you know what you're.

Son said he wants to be when he grows up.

My oldest who's six, and I was like, what?

She was like, he wants
to be a Bitcoin miner.

And I was like, oh really?

And he wants to, wants to be like dad.

And uh, and I was like, you know
what, I, I thought about that a lot.

And I was like, well, why wait,
you know, he's been out to a site.

He went out to the 10 net zero
site, uh, the off grid site

out there, and so he's seen it.

You know, firsthand, he's
been to the Bitcoin meetups.

Uh, he's always, he was Adam
Empower like all three years.

Um, I was like, you know, why wait.

So I tweeted about that
and Gian sent me a message.

He goes, Hey, I'm gonna hook
your son up with a bid X.

And so, oh sweet.

Yeah, I've got that being delivered.

And so just wanted to give him a shout.

I was really thoughtful and really
kind of him, uh, for doing that.

So if you guys are looking for any
equipment, go check those guys out.

Uh, I really appreciate.

Thanks again.

Yep.

Go check those guys out.

Yeah's a good dude.

He actually does a lot
of work with us too.

Does he?

Good dude.

Yep.

Yep.

I love Gian.

Um, so yeah, yeah, totally big fan
of him and, uh, and basic money.

Love it.

So what, what about you though, bro?

I mean, I know, but don't you,
uh, kind of delve a little bit?

You've talked about it here and there
on the show, but Matt, I, you know, I've

alluded to it a whole lot of detail.

Yeah, yeah.

You've alluded to it,
but I've alluded to it.

So, and the reason I haven't been like, I.

Full offensive with, with
putting content out about that.

Even though I've been recording a
lot of stuff behind the scenes that

will release like well after the fact
is, um, we, you know, we've, we've

looked at a few different deals and
one of the deals, um, and he may be

listening to the show, but we were, we
were looking at some of their assets,

some, some oil and gas assets and, uh.

I was like, don't violate
any NCAAs right now.

I was like, or NDAs, I'm sorry.

I was like, Hey, like, you know, we
know we're like looking at y'all's

assets and he is like, oh yeah, I know.

He's like, I've, I've made a
pitch to, uh, management for us

to like go and do this ourselves.

And he pulled this whole presentation.

He was like, yes, where I learned it all.

He's like, your podcast.

And I was like, oh, okay.

So I was like, I'm gonna be a little
quieter, uh, about certain things,

but I'll talk, I'll talk high
level about what we're working on.

So obviously, you know, um,
really the, the seed was planted.

Uh, really with a first in power.

Um, just really just getting thrown
into kind of the center of this,

this ecosystem and getting to meet
a lot of people and see all the

cool things that they're working on.

And it was a huge, you
know, learning curve.

Obviously understanding the oil and gas
side, but kind of diving into mining and

then subsequently into, you know, into
AI and to, to power generation, all this.

And so.

I was always trying to put together
the thesis of like, what does the

energy company of the future look like?

And that was really always
my goal in digital Wildfire.

What Digital Wilders gave me the
opportunity to have a great platform to

meet a lot of really smart, successful,
hardworking people, and to learn a lot

and to build an absolutely great network
of people that I can recruit for the

team of, you know, capital providers.

And.

Banks and a variety of other things.

Right?

And, um, it just kind of became
clear to me this was something that

I was starting to spend more like
nights and weekends thinking about.

And I talked about it publicly about,
you know, the direction that I thought

that particularly oil and gas companies
should go, those that have a significant

amount of gas and kind of getting
more into the Bitcoin mining space.

And, um, it seemingly
has fallen on deaf ears.

And so I kinda got to the point to
where I was in, uh, I was in Fort Worth.

Me and Phil Stanley were, um.

Just like out having drinks one night
and I was like, man, I got this thesis.

Somebody should go like do this and uh.

He was like, well, why don't you do it?

And I was like, dude, I, I have a rule.

I can't just do like one thing at a time.

Um, and so that kind of plan, I
obviously don't follow that rule.

You don't follow that rule very well.

I got like any, any point, like
12 jobs, but, uh, Sarah has worked

on me and I'm kind of, I'm, I'm
reigning it in, but go ahead.

My bad.

And he was like, well,
what if I did it with you?

And I was like, well,
then that changes things.

And so, um, you know, fast forward
a little bit, I, uh, exit digital

wildcatters and, and left to go
pursue starting quarterly energy.

So I guess the million dollar
question is what are we doing?

I'm talking about the thesis,
but I wanted to kinda give some

context to how we got here.

And so we are, uh, in the process
of, you know, fingers crossed.

Purchasing some natural
gas assets in Texas.

Uh, it's a significant amount of gas.

Um, and then a lot of other infrastructure
associated with a bunch of pipelines,

uh, and some other stuff won't give
away too many details so people

don't pick up on what I'm putting
down on exactly which site this is.

Um, but we plan on turning
all that gas into power.

And so we have the capacity
currently for, uh, approximately.

Once you kind of factor in, shrink
about 150 megawatts of power.

And so we will be, uh, selling half
that to AI data centers and then

we'll Bitcoin mine off the other half.

Um, and then we'll also build an
interconnect to be able to sell

power back to the grid, which is.

As we talked about on the show, it's,
it's pretty much a lottery ticket,

but, uh, it's a lottery ticket
that's worth it, uh, in my opinion.

So we plan on growing the volumes over
time through more strategic acquisitions.

If we have to drill, we will, um,
we'll be getting a significant amount

of leases as well, but ideally by just
acquiring more, uh, other producing

natural gas assets, being able to
time into our infrastructure, grow

the volumes, bring on as much power
as we can, and then rinse and repeat.

And so we're, we're looking
at going up to Alaska.

It's kind of, I logical.

Kind of next step.

There's a ton of gas up there.

People don't realize that that's
the largest gas field in the

entire world, and they just don't
have a market for it, right?

So they reinject like eight, eight
and a half B, CF, a gas a day.

Um, and so they've already
been kind of courting.

Hyperscale is up there and
Bitcoin miners and they want to

incentivize them to come up there.

Um, so that's probably a
logical next step for us.

Also, you know, obviously Ohio,
Pennsylvania, those are, you know, right

there in the Marcellus and the Utica.

There's just a ton of gas and so that's
something that we, we could consider

potentially in the future as well.

We've got a great team, so
obviously myself, Phil Stanley.

For those who don't know Phil, you can go
back and listen to the episode that we did

with him, um, kinda a few episodes back.

But Phil was, you know, one of
the first investors in Giga.

Um, and he's invested in a lot of other
on grid and off-grid Bitcoin mining.

Uh, done very well, done
very well for himself.

Um, uh, Mark Meyer.

He's the former CTO, uh,
of Apache Corporation.

So Apache, really large oil and gas
company been around a very long time.

Um, before that, he ran research at the
investment bank, t Pickering and Holt.

Then before that he ran the, uh,
Raymond family office, and then

part of that, he was at Goldman.

So Mark's hands, dude, you
guys are freaking ballers, bro.

He's a baller.

He's a, he is a hardcore baller man.

He's, um, he's one of the smartest
people I ever met in the industry.

And, um, I actually, I went to
him not thinking that I was gonna

like, get him onto the team.

I went to him to pitch him and say
like, Hey, like if anybody's gonna tear

this thesis apart, it's gonna be him.

And so.

I told him what we were working on
and he was like, yeah, this is it.

And then he goes on a monologue for
like an hour of like why it would work.

And I was like, oh, I
wasn't expecting that.

And I'm like, so what do you wanna do?

He was like, I wanna
get back on the field.

I wanna do this.

And I was like, done.

I.

You're on the team.

Sweet.

I said, what's my role?

And I was like, I don't care.

You're like, what the,
whatever you want, bro known.

Yeah.

We'll make it work.

And then, um, the man who's doing most
of the work right now, who's really put

the team on his back is, uh, Tim Bozeman.

So Tim, uh, started Win Bite acquisition,
sold that to MD America, and then

stayed on to, to run that for their
investors for, for quite a long time.

And so he's, I've met a lot of engineers,
um, you know, throughout my career.

And, and Tim is, is up
there with the best of them.

And what I love about Tim is he also is,
uh, is not just, uh, not just intelligent.

He was also very creative.

Um, and he always finds a
solution to all sorts of problems.

And he's just the most even keel
guy you ever met in your life.

He's just very laid back and relaxed
and just has like the best attitude

and loves spending time with him.

So, yeah, he's, uh, he's brilliant.

He's doing, uh, most of our
evaluation work right now,

trying to get this deal done.

So yeah, he's really putting the team
on his back, but it's exciting man.

It's exciting.

I'm fired up, man.

Like getting this close to actually
closing on something like that.

Yeah, man.

It's exciting and it's, it's
something that, um, I don't know.

I'm gonna be very happy for you.

Very proud of you, man.

Fingers crossed man.

Fingers crossed.

Ain't close it yet, but I'm, I'm hoping
the next I know, but man, just ish.

Yeah, and, and just getting out and
doing stuff is scary for a lot of people.

Most people don't ever do the things
that they actually want to do.

And you know, I'm, this is not intended
to be a knock on digital wildcatters

or anything at all, but like I.

Leaving something like that to
go pursue what you want to do.

I, I try to tell people all the
time is like, just, man, we only

live one time and we're all dying.

Like, don't waste all your time
doing stuff either working with

people you don't wanna work with or
working in something you don't want

to work with and like get out and
go do the thing that you feel like.

God's calling you to do.

Man, don't, don't waste no time.

It's not worth it.

Yeah.

End of the day it's not gonna matter.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Like you're, you're going to wanna look
back and be like, I, I had a good time.

We get one shot and it's like,
man, I hope, I enjoy as many of my

days as possible and when work is
that big of a, a portion of your

life, you better freaking enjoy it.

So no point in sitting around doing
stuff that you don't really wanna do.

I'm proud of you, man, just for
going after what, you know, going

after something you wanted do.

I'm proud you, I'm proud of you, dude.

Thanks.

Thanks, Jake.

I appreciate it, man.

Alright.

You wanna talk some events?

Alright, enough to circle jerk.

Let's, uh, let's get into some things
that are happening in the world that

we are paying, paying attention to.

A obviously, kind of the billion dollar
question right now is, it's up, it's

down, it's left, it's right, tariffs.

How are, how are you
thinking about tariffs?

How are tariffs, you know, kind
of affecting, uh, this space?

I mean, the obvious one is, is, uh.

Like the tariff, the pause that Trump did.

Um, you know, there's, that was great.

I made some good money that day.

Um, still on the whole MSTU and MSTR
and MSTY, uh, train, even though I

certainly bought in at a high time,
I've been, I've been working some

ways to, uh, get some money back and
actually this volatility has helped.

So, um, that's been good.

But there's obviously a lot of uncertainty
right now and, um, the tariffs.

With China being kinda really the,
the, I feel like it's really the

US versus China the main villain.

China.

Yeah.

Right.

It, it really is.

At the end of the day, it's what it is.

And this, especially with this 90
day pause, but so much of the mining

industry, uh, manufacturing, uh,
infrastructure, the computers, everything.

Come from China.

So that's obviously, uh,
gonna impact it quite a bit.

Now, the 90 day pause has,
gives 'em some relief.

'cause a lot of it comes from
like Malaysia, those areas too.

Um, but it is gonna be really
interesting to see what happens.

I, I think it was Ethan over
at Luxor was talking about like

another 36% tariff on this machine.

On the machine cost.

It, it can virtually make these
machines never pay out like that.

That's a reality.

And so, um.

Is this, if, how long these stick
around and how, how bad it, it ends up

getting, we're at a hash price right now.

It's like 44 bucks a
pet of hash that's low.

And so the margins are
already super, super thin.

But, so depending on how long
these stick around, there could be

some serious impact on hash rate.

Um, minor profitability.

I mean, I, I.

I don't know how it's gonna play out.

I don't think anybody does.

And that's, that's part of the
problem for the market, right,

is we don't know what's going on.

Um, but for miners, like, well, like
myself and the ones who, uh, I'm

actually kind of excited because
we have machines running here.

Um, and so the value on
those goes up quite a bit.

Um, so, and the value of really
any machines that already

states that I imagine, which
now start to command a premium.

Right.

And if you've seen all the, the, the
amount of money being paid to try to

get things in right now before this 90
day window's up, um, I think it's up to

like July 9th or something like that.

There's people trying
to get things in now.

Um, but the, the.

The, just the Chinese, um, tariff
alone is, it's, it is gonna cause some

serious upheaval if it sticks around.

So, I mean, there's a lot gonna happen.

The, the next 90 days is a,
is a very interesting time.

I, I think that there's potential
that we could see hash rate.

Be affected, maybe not immediately,
but the hash rate, um, increase, could

certainly start slowing down tremendously.

I, I, I do see that happening, but
I, I think people are gonna, I mean,

trying to raise money right now,
um, with the tariffs in place, I.

I, I don't envy anybody trying
to do that if they're a straight

Bitcoin miner right now.

Like that.

It's gotta be tough because there's,
there's so much uncertainty as to what's

gonna happen because of the tariffs.

So, um, now that being said, I actually
think if you're just looking at purely

for, from like what is the US doing
to combat China, I'm still believing

that, um, there's a plan in place and.

You know, there, I, I'm, I'm with
the whole narrative that there is

going to be pain before there's
a lot of gains, and so I'm, I'm,

I'm in it for the long haul, man.

I'm not, I'm not gonna bail on, on
this strategy that Trump's had with it.

I.

I trust them to continue to move forward
and, and hopefully it works out and,

uh, hopefully we got a better, uh, hand
of cards than, than the Chinese do.

Um, but for the mining world, I
think there's gonna be a little

bit of pain from this for a
while, and maybe not a little bit.

It might be a lot of pain.

Yeah, it's, you know, I've, I've, man,
I've tried to educate myself as much as I

can on the topic and, and listen to a lot
of podcasts and I've kind of gone back and

forth and I kind of see both sides of it.

I think I've kind of
settled on, and I agree.

I think there's gonna be
a lot of short-term pain.

I do think this kind of, um, I.

I don't know, I guess maybe reshuffling
of the cards, uh, to get us back into

more of a dominant, secure position as
really the leaders of the free world.

Uh, I think it's probably essential
and we've seen a few things

already play out exactly the
way that they intended them to.

And so certain car manufacturers that
are like European car manufacturers

are actually planning on building
factories here in the us, um,

which is, that's the entire point,
is to bring back manufacturing.

Right now.

I do understand the point that
there are certain types of.

Manufacturing jobs that are probably just
not going to be available, uh, or nobody's

gonna want to do that kind of work.

Mm-hmm.

Until probably three years from
now when we have like AI powered,

you know, robotics that can
manufacture just about anything.

Um, but this administration wants that to
be built in the US and I understand that.

Then also from, um.

Security standpoint with, uh,
things, I know this doesn't have

to do with this show, but like
pharmaceuticals, I mean, most of our

pharmaceuticals are made in China.

Like imagine if some other pandemic,
uh, was, was to kind of break out and

they were the ones who, you know, kind
of held, you know, all of the, the,

whether it be a, whether some sort of
medication or, or whatever for this SA

great, great position to be structor too.

Yeah, grid infrastructure too, like
the whole thing about the Chinese

manufactured transformers, utility level
transformers with the back doors in them.

Like that's real stuff.

You know what I mean?

Mm-hmm.

That's that.

That is something that from a
national security perspective,

I do think the administrations
have an obligation to confront.

You can't, you can't ignore that.

And so, yeah, pharmaceuticals, grid
infrastructure, like those things.

Those are real things that, that
I do believe completely, um, you

know, the Trump administration, any
presidential administration should

be, uh, taking on and confronting.

So yeah, man, it's, it's, it's going to
be painful for a little bit, but I also,

I think it's necessary in some level.

I'm curious, I am curious how this is
gonna play out with, obviously we saw

like that massive swing, like we've seen
swings, dude, within, between opening and

closing in a single day of the s and p.

Just, you know, absolutely taking
a shit and then coming back

and then taking a shit again.

And it's, it's, it's hard to say.

What is the investor
appetite for this space?

Uh, going to be particularly over the
next, let's just call it 12 months.

Oh, dude, it's, I, I don't know.

Like, I think there's gonna be
continued uncertainty for a while.

Like these things are, I, I don't
think the volatility's gone away.

It, it actually, the, it was down
the last few days, but like, I don't,

I don't think the volatility in the
market is gonna go away until there's

some serious resolution with Europeans.

With, I, I don't think China's
gonna get resolved anytime soon.

Um, but, but the rest of the
world, like as some of those

chips start falling in place.

There'll be a little bit
of normalcy come back.

I tend to also, and I hope I don't come
back in, you know, six months and be

like, man, I was totally wrong, but.

I tend to think that there's often,
uh, overblown drama and rhetoric,

um, in, in times like this.

And so, yeah, I mean, the uncertainty's
real, um, the impacts on the bond market

stuff, like, I'm not a financial expert
by any stretch of the imagination, but,

um, the, the dumping of the bonds that
we've seen has been pretty dramatic,

and that I think is something that.

That could have a lasting
impact for a little while.

I think that's something
that could carry on.

And I do think that that ultimately,
even though we haven't totally seen,

seen it, I do think that Bitcoin
continues to chip away and steal

some of the, the safe haven narrative
and pull, pull it over to its side.

You know what I mean?

I, I do think they're starting
to be a little bit of a, the, the

rest of the world's looking at it.

Taking it more serious, the strategic
Bitcoin reserve, even though that

hasn't all been resolved, I think
that's kinda giving the rest of

the world the, um, viewpoint of
like, we need to take this serious.

And they're gonna start kind of looking
for ways to accumulate more Bitcoin.

Um, you know, I don't know how this
impacts the US and the ability to,

to get access to cheap capital if
the bond market is impacted like

it has been and continues to erode.

Um, I don't know how that shakes out, man.

I'm, I'm a lawyer, you know, I'm
not, I'm not, we should call Marty

Bent and have him on again 'cause,
you know, this is kind of his area.

But, um, I do think that.

Long term, this is probably
all good for Bitcoin.

What's going on right now?

I would agree.

I dunno, what do you think, dude?

And I, I think, so it's, it seems
like this is kind of like the, the

perfect storm and you're starting
to see, you know, this is not like

great for us as a nation necessarily.

It's good for Bitcoin where, uh,
Russia and China are settling

energy contracts in Bitcoin.

Right, right.

That's big.

How long we been saying
that's gonna happen though.

You know what I mean?

I, I, I do think that that is,
that's, it's almost impossible

to me for that not to happen.

On a big scale, like I don't think
the dollar's gonna always be the,

the currency that oil's based in.

I just don't, and that's not because
I'm unpatriotic, it's just 'cause I

think if I'm the rest of the world,
that's probably where I start going.

That's the reality.

Well, there's a lot of other things
that are happening kind of in

the policy space that, you know,
affect, uh, you know, this industry.

And so one of the, one of the, one of
the hot topics was a proposed bill,

uh, called the Clean Ca Cloud Act.

Um, that is, it's proposing that
it requires, uh, 11% annual carbon

reductions from bitcoin miners, AI
data centers, and with the end goal.

This is where it gets pretty
retarded is, uh, a hundred

percent renewable power by 2035.

So absurd.

Let's just talk, let's
just zoom out, right?

It ain't happening.

You talk to anybody everywhere,
whether it's, you know, at a Bitcoin

mining events or an AI conference.

What's everybody talking about?

Power.

There's not enough power.

And so, you know, and we'll kinda talk
about with some of the stuff that we're

seeing and some of the transactions,
but if you're wanting to go particularly

on grid, get in line, you know?

Correct.

That's why we're starting to see
a lot more sites start to transact

from, you know, AI groups coming
to buying Bitcoin miners and the.

Forecast for what we need in
power production just here in

the US is like astronomical.

It's like three times
what we have currently.

And so by trying to propose
a bill to hamstring that,

um, doesn't make any sense.

I mean, AI is going to be a zero sum game.

Right.

It's whoever wins this dominates.

It's like, it's the equivalent of
if the internet was privatized and

a company could have a piece of
that, what would that be worth?

Over time?

And that's why there's no limit to what
these tech companies are willing to spend

on sites and on power, on infrastructure.

They will invest whatever
it takes to win this game.

And we want kind of
going back to security.

We want us to be the leaders in that.

Right.

Right.

I don't want the entire world
to be run off Chinese ai.

Sorry.

No.

No.

Yeah.

So this is, it just, it
absolutely doesn't make sense.

And the emission standards currently,
'cause this is something, this

was like our biggest, one of
our biggest bottlenecks, right?

Um, for quarterly energy, it's the
procurement of turbines, right?

In a realistic.

Timeframe.

Um, not to mention, you
know, they're not cheap.

Um, but being able to even get an order
in and have them delivered in a reasonable

amount of time is problem number one.

Oh, it's crazy.

Problem number two is making sure that we.

Are within the, um, you know,
the emission standards, right?

And so it's, it's specking out
the right kinds of turbines.

It's putting on SCRs, on the
turbines, it's putting on chillers

to keep the efficiency down, right?

It's thinking of what can, what creative
ways of what we can do with the emissions.

Whether that be, uh, you know, carbon
capturing, getting paid 45 Q credits.

Um, you know, are you
in an area like in the.

Central portion of like the DFW area
are in Houston, which is called the,

the ozone non-attainment areas, right?

Where the, the permitting process
and the emissions regulations

are even more stringent.

And so it's already very,
very difficult to comply, uh,

with these emission standards.

And so trying to impose any
other additional carbon reduction

is really just kind of talking
outside both sides of your mouth.

If you want America to
be the leader, uh, of ai.

I heard everything you said, and
yes, I, uh, I completely agree,

um, that, that there is virtually
no way that that is gonna happen.

Um, I, I know, uh, Waylon, uh,
again, over at TEG, uh, we had

a group we met with Encore.

To discuss some availability of power
at different locations, whatnot, the

large scale loads that are required
for like AI or AI infrastructure

and running AI applications.

Is huge.

Um, there is virtually no power available
at the scale on grid that they need.

Um, so when you're hearing all these
different, you know, we're, there's

gonna be this many megawatts, gigawatts
of power going here and there it isn't,

there's no, there's none available.

There's just not.

And so that's where the gas generation
and, and coal opportunities getting

revisited, that's where that's
coming from because it's literally

the only thing that's available
in the timeframe that they need it

and at the scale that they need it.

And so, yeah, when I hear these
things about what they're gonna do

and they're, you know, a hundred
percent renewable and all it, I don't

even know why people entertain it.

It's a waste of time.

It's rhetoric and it, there's virtually
no way that that is gonna happen.

Zero.

Yeah.

I think natural gas is gonna put
down right now natural gas is

gonna put the demand on its back.

Right.

Um, you know, nuclear still
in, in my view, 10 to 15 out.

10 to 15 years out from today.

Day we're, yeah.

Um, we may see some of these old
coal plants kinda get revitalized,

but I think there's gonna be.

Probably a little bit too much pushback.

We'll talk about that here in a second.

Um, but I think natural gas is gonna
be the bulk of new power generation

moving forward for at least the, the
next decade, which is e exactly the

reason that I'm going out and trying
to pursue some opportunities here.

Well, I think that it's the
way, um, and actually TEG we're

working on some of those too.

Um, so it, it's, the, the
toughest part is having access

to turbines like you touched on.

Dude, they, they're so far out right
now, depending on, uh, who you talk to.

I've heard up to like three,
four years at this point.

And that was from like a week or two ago.

So, um, it's tough and, but
that's why you guys are gonna

be positioned for success, man.

I know you're gonna land
some fingers crossed.

Yeah, no, we're gonna man.

The, the market for it.

Like everybody's, everybody's chasing
the same thing, but like you touched

on your team and the ability to,
um, put this whole thing together.

To me it's completely dependent on
the type of team you have and like,

are they capable of understanding the
power and the oil and gas side and,

and kind of checking all the boxes and
bringing things together the right way.

It's harder than people think,
man, it, it might sound easy.

It's much more difficult
than what people think.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's in, in, yeah.

There's been a lot of, uh, roadblocks
and kind of pivots along the way

to even get us to this point.

So I get a turbine and I go get
the gas, and it's like, dude, it's

just, this is way more difficult
than, than what you're putting on.

It.

It, it reminds me of back in like 20 20,
20 21 when everybody was like wanting

to do the natural gas, bitcoin mining.

I had so many people call me, Hey, I wanna
do, I wanna do an off grid Bitcoin mine.

Uh, like, uh, where do I get a well?

It's like, dude, you
just gonna go buy one.

Well, you just gonna, you're
so, you're so out of your depth.

If you think you're just gonna come into
the industry and, and start operating,

well gas, it's, just take it over.

Right.

It's, it's absurd.

So, but yeah, you touched on it too.

The other thing that, um, I, I'm
interested in what is going to

happen going forward is like the
Galaxy deal that they just did.

I think it was core.

We bought, uh, a Galaxy site.

I think it was 200 megawatts,
something like that.

The, those sites are the ones that if
you want stable grid power or even stable

behind the meter power, most of those
are already taken up by Bitcoin miners.

So at what point are we going
to see the Bitcoin miners

are selling to the AI groups?

Um, and they, well, we're,
we're seeing it now.

I mean this is like Core
Weaves playbook, right?

They go to Core Scientific, they do
that like 10 year or 12 year, whatever.

Mm-hmm.

Like 12, $14 billion.

I remember the number exactly.

We talked about it.

It's a lot a while back, but
now they're doing the same thing

with, with the Galaxy site.

And it seems like this is gonna be
like their model and like once again.

There's no limit to what
we're willing to pay.

We need the infrastructure,
we need it today.

And so, right, we're gonna
just start buying sites.

In my, where I'm getting curious
is like, at what point does

that start impacting hash rate?

You know what I mean?

You, you start having hash rate
getting pulled offline because Right.

The AI sites are coming in
and significant amounts of it.

200 megawatts is nothing
to sneeze at, you know?

So.

Um, and to think like the money
being poured into ai, if they

can go buy a 200 megawatt.

Big company facility to shut it down
and then pay $10 million a megawatt

to build out their infrastructure.

I mean, I'm sure there'll be some
overlap and reduction of that, but

even if you're paying 5 million
for that, like that's a lot.

And I don't, I think it'll be more than.

If you're paying 10 per megawatt
right now, I don't think there's

gonna be $5 million of overlap because
it doesn't cost that much to build

a Bitcoin mine in the first place.

So I think, if I remember correctly,
the, I ran the numbers on the core

weave, core scientific deal, and I
think it was like 13 million a megawatt.

I could be wrong.

Right?

It's it's expensive.

It was really high.

It's expensive.

Yeah.

So I do think that, um,
there'll be a point where.

Uh, that starts impacting hash
rate because like the AI groups

aren't gonna wait forever for
the gas generation to get there.

Or then the grid power co.

Again, that's gonna be probably three
years if you're 1, 2, 3, 400 megawatts.

And we need to get the guy from
tg Ja, Jason Bear, um, and a

couple other dudes who come on
here to talk about some of this.

But like Chris Miller
would be a good one too.

The, the timeframe that
it is gonna take to get.

Grid power at one of these sites.

You're talking minimum
like two years minimum.

So it's like extra high.

We already talked about that.

It's a zero sum game, but a lot of
these groups, they have orders in that

they had placed forever ago for GPUs.

You can't have $10 billion of GPU sitting
in storage, collecting dust depreciating

massively while your competitors are out.

Outspending you, right.

So it's gonna be interesting, man.

I, I think there could be more of
those type of acquisitions coming.

And I do think at some point
there's going to be probably some

type of knock on the hash rate.

I mean, so much of those AI groups
are coming to the US and the US has

like, I think 36% of the hash rate.

Those are the only sites that really
have that level of capability.

They're Bitcoin miners.

Um, at some point there's gonna be a
little bit of a ding that's good for,

for guys like me that have, you know,
smaller mining operations of, you know,

hash rate going down is, is good for us.

So, um, it's not the worst thing in the
world, but it, it's gonna be interesting

to see how the bitcoin mining industry.

Moves forward with ai, you know, trying to
gobble up and the amount of capital they

have to gobble up some of these sites.

I do think still, and I've talked about
this before, um, and I think there's

legislation actually in Texas now about
this, but these large AI groups, or

it's talking about getting proposed.

These large AI groups having
to contribute some level of

their power back at peak times.

Like that to me, is going to require
there to be some type of backup,

redundant power available to them,
um, in order to accommodate that need.

And so I, I think that also leads to the
whole kind of thesis I've had, which is.

AI is going to have to have some component
of Bitcoin mining with it just to.

Accommodate the needs that the
grid is gonna have for flexibility

during certain periods of time.

I just hundred percent think that.

And, and if that legislation gets
moved forward, I think that there's,

it, it has to, it, it will pass.

I, I, I really believe that one, one of
the problems is that a lot of these groups

are trying to permit a lot more power
than they're gonna bring online initially.

Of course.

And that's created a massive
issue for the grid from a, from

a, a low balancing perspective.

And so being able to meet that.

Whatever you're permitting with
Bitcoin mining so that you have

that large flexible load that you
can curtail and sell power back.

It's this convergence.

You know, I think we've talked about it
for, for a while now, where, you know,

Bitcoin miners are becoming AI companies,
AI companies are becoming Bitcoin

miners, and maybe there's a new term
where for these groups kind of, uh, you

know, as, as they've kind of merged, so.

Um, yeah, you're saying there's a few
other ones I've got on my list here.

Bit Digital, uh, is pivoting into
ai, so they're buying a 53 million

facility in North Carolina for ai.

Um, riot is currently eyeing, um,
tenants for their one gigawatt Texas

campus, um, specifically for ai.

Um.

DOE is opening up federal land for
AI data centers and power projects.

So I guess there's 16 new federal
sites that have been unlocked

for AI in infrastructure and
onsite power demand that's big.

Um, Google and PJM are using
AI to accelerate power grid

interconnections, so using AI to
fix the grid kind, kind of awesome.

Um.

Microsoft's kind of pulling a little bit
of a pause on all their new AI buildouts.

They had bought the three Mile Island
nuclear facility that was mothballed

and trying to bring that back.

And so I think that they're really
trying to go all in on nuclear.

I don't know if this is just posturing
or if this is actually, um, you know,

there's their kind of stance on this.

I don't really know.

I don't know either, man.

Um, anything.

Anything, uh, bill Gates involved
in, I, I get kind of squeamish about,

so I don't know, man, bill Gates
in a freaking nuclear facility.

Man, this sounds scary.

It sounds like a movie.

Two other things on the policy side
that we skipped over would be, uh, Ted

Cruz has introduced the Flare Act to
incentivize, uh, Bitcoin mining with

flared gas, which makes a ton of sense.

Mm-hmm.

And I feel like I have to take at
least a little bit of credit, not

taking credit with, I'm sure, I'm sure.

Uh, Lee and a bunch of other guys
have also played probably a much

larger part than I did, but we
had Ted Cruz the first in power.

It was his first kind of exposure
to Bitcoin mining and then we hosted

a little, uh, a breakfast the next
morning with like 20 of the largest

miners for a couple hours and he asked
a lot of like really great questions.

And so I feel like that was
kind of the genesis of kind

of getting him on this track.

So just gonna pat myself
on the back a little bit.

Yeah.

Jake, so well done.

I know, but this, this actually
sense, the power just got a

history of making a great impact.

We gotta bring it back.

We gotta bring it back.

Gotta bring it back.

Another, another shame
was plug firm power.

And then, uh, last thing I have
on my list would be, uh, Trump is

trying to bring back coal power for
AI infrastructure we talked about.

I think, yeah, I mean we, not to be
a dead horse, but if it comes down to

national security, zero sum game, zero
sum game for ai, us being the leaders

in that, if it comes down to having to.

Fire up some coal power generation,
then absolutely we should do it.

Oh, yeah, I, I think we should do it.

I, I mean those, all of those
reasons are reasons to do it.

And honestly, man Trump, he
ain't worried about that.

He, he's gonna be all about it.

Hey, what about American Bitcoin?

We didn't even talk about that.

Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, uh, Eric Trump launched American
Bitcoin with, um, I don't know if he's

Trump trains getting on the Bitcoin train.

The HUD eight CEO Asher.

Yeah.

GaN.

Mm-hmm.

I think that's how you pronounce it.

Yeah.

Um, I love the ambition.

I mean, they're saying that they want
to be the largest, pure play Bitcoin

miner in North America with 50 XA
hash and a Bitcoin treasury reserve.

Um, love the ambition.

How are they gonna raise the money
to be able to outpace Mara and Riot?

Mm-hmm.

And anybody else who's, uh,
already pretty much at that scale.

Um, and its also Trump coin.

Probably use Trump coin, maybe
the Trump Gold card and, uh.

And it's also just, it's a weird
positioning to say that you're

gonna be a pure play minor given
everything we just talked about.

Right.

And all the reasons why there is this
convergence and wanting to diversify

into, you know, different revenue
streams with, with the infrastructure,

just given the demand and, and
just how much money you can make.

It just seems like an odd move at
this time to, to go and be pure play.

But I'm, you know, curious play that.

I would say that, I would
say that too if, um.

If I didn't think that, uh, and I'm
not saying from an ethical standpoint

whether it's good or bad, but I
think watching what the freaking

market will do when Trump tweets I.

I can't imagine what Bitcoin would do
when Trump tweeted some other stuff.

You know what I mean?

We saw just him winning the, the
huge run up on Bitcoin that we saw.

Um, but I'm not gonna add, there was
part of me when I saw that, um, that was

like, man, Bitcoin had a million bucks.

I.

Would probably start seriously
rivaling anything that you

could get from the AI world.

So, yeah, I don't know, man.

And then when I saw the tariff,
uh, revenues from tariffs could

be considered a budget neutral.

Um.

You know, way to a, acquire
Bitcoin for the strategic reserve

in the government's opinion.

That's pretty interesting.

Um, there was some other ways, I
can't remember off the top of my

head that they mentioned would be
considered budget neutral ways to stack

Bitcoin for the strategic reserve.

Um.

If that started happening, if, if the
US government was a buyer with the, I

can't remember what they're saying, the
tariffs should produce 600 plus billion

dollars a year or something like that.

Um, that's a pretty big pocketbook
to be buying some Bitcoin with, man.

Yeah.

Michael Sale don't have nothing on that.

So lot of, lot of cool stuff, man.

This, I mean, it's never
been more, oh yeah.

Super interesting.

More fun to be in this space.

At the intersection of all these things.

There's a lot of movement.

It's kinda weird.

Isn't it weird that like bitcoin's
been like relatively like steady

at like 84,000, knock on wood.

I know, but I, I do think that goes
back to, um, hopefully, and I said this

actually, there was that dip back down
in the seventies after he announced, you

know, liberation Day or whatever it was.

But it took a couple days after the
market moved, before Bitcoin kinda tanked.

Now Bitcoin came back up.

Um, and yeah, you know, I, I've heard
people, I read these articles and they're

always like, oh, Bitcoin the big pullback.

And it's like, man, this has been a week.

Two weeks since it was in the seventies.

And, but they're still talking
about it as if it's right now.

And so, yeah, it has held up
relatively well when you compare

it to the rest of the market.

So, um, I think it's a testament
to the narrative change that's

kind of coming, um, with, you
know, Bitcoin being looked at as.

A dollar replacement or a safe, uh,
as far as world currency is concerned,

um, or being a safe haven asset.

Um, and I just think people recognize
the potential for it down the road.

I, I saw some great articles
from like, Forbes and, and.

You know, even the Wall Street Journal,
I believe, uh, just about the positioning

that of Bitcoin and what it could
do with the dollar slipping sum and

with the uncertainty in the market.

And it's like, man, two years
ago, we would've never saw, I.

Anything like that in a, you know,
what did Lisa call when she's on here?

Lame stream media or something?

Or, or legacy media?

Legacy media.

You know, we wouldn't have
seen that type of stuff before.

And so, uh, yeah, I, I'm.

I do feel like there's been a
major, major narrative shift.

Um, and I think that's just
gonna continue to happen.

I really do.

So I think we we're, I'm never gonna say
that we're not susceptible to wild swings.

We always will be.

I think it's, it acts like
a commodity a lot of ways.

And you know how to, it's a, it's
a, you've been an oil gas road.

It's 24 7, 365.

Right?

Right.

Like it's always the same.

Volatility is a feature on a bug.

Right, right.

And so, um, I don't know, man, I,
I've also moved past a lot of the,

you know, the early stages of like
Bitcoin adoption on an individual basis.

Those wild swings seem scare you.

They don't really bother me anymore, man.

No, they, I not really at all.

It's like, yeah, I don't pay
attention to, you know, you.

Yeah.

You, you used to.

I don't, but it's on my home screen.

My, it's on my lock screen, my phone,
but I don't really pay that to, yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, I look, I definitely look every
day, but I honestly, I look at it to see

what I want to do when I'm playing with
like MSTU and, and those, I don't like.

My Bitcoin's my Bitcoin, man.

I get it.

That's, I just keep, I just keep
buying, keep buying and keep mining.

Stacking it, baby.

Well, I think that's a, so I
told my daughter to get tattooed.

Keep buying.

Yeah.

Keep buying and keep mining that.

That's a tattoo.

Yep.

I'm gonna tell her.

You guys good to be back.

If y'all are interested in, uh,
getting on the wait list for

Empower, wanna give some feedback?

Great idea, terrible idea.

We know it's a great idea, but if
you don't think it's a good idea,

love, also know about it as well.

Uh, go fill out the wait list.

I'll put in the show notes.

It's also@energizingbitcoin.com.

Just go to the, the top there and
just click on Empower and, uh, yeah.

We'll see you guys again soon.

Later.